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ATB - laydown 3N, with a couple of minor flaws

Poll: ATB - laydown 3N, with a couple of minor flaws (21 member(s) have cast votes)

What should have happened?

  1. Exactly what did (3 votes [14.29%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 14.29%

  2. N should have passed initially (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  3. S should have raised spades (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  4. S should have bid 3N over 2S (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  5. N should have passed 2N (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  6. N should have cued 3D over 2N (meaning what?) (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  7. N should have bid 3S over 2N (2 votes [9.52%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 9.52%

  8. N should have bid 4S over 2N (6 votes [28.57%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 28.57%

  9. Other (6 votes [28.57%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 28.57%

  10. N should have bid 3S over 1N (3 votes [14.29%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 14.29%

  11. S should have passed 2S (1 votes [4.76%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 4.76%

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#21 User is offline   1eyedjack 

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Posted 2017-February-13, 14:06

View PostPhilG007, on 2017-February-13, 13:23, said:

How does 3NT make on a club lead? This I gotta see(!)��


Sheesh! You are being deliberately obtuse.

Let me ask you this: How does 4S make on a club lead? This I gotta see(!)

My comment to which you responded, highlighted so that even you can see it was:

"Yes, 4S can make ON A POINTY SUIT LEAD. But *THEN* (ie on a pointy suit lead) 3N makes the same."

At what point in this sentence to you suggest that I am implying a Club lead? I repeat, in what universe that you inhabit is a Club a pointy suit?

Just in case the terminology is new to you, a Pointy suit is Spades or Diamonds, because the top of the suit symbol ends in a sharp point, as opposed to a "rounded" suit (Hearts or Clubs).

Nowhere in this thread did I ever suggest that 3N makes on a Club lead. You however did suggest that 4S makes.

To really spell it out. 3N and 4S both fail on a Club or Heart lead. Both succeed on a Spade or Diamond lead. You argued that 4S is superior "because it makes". Even you should be able to see the fallacy.

You apparently get the right to choose the opening lead that happens to defeat both 3N and 4S as an argument against 3N, and at the same time the right to choose the opening lead that happens to allow both 3N and 4S to make as an argument in favour of 4S.

You could argue that 4S is superior because it is ONLY going to go two down when it fails, where 3N is likely to go more down. You could argue that. But you didn't.

Had it been someone else making your points I would have assumed it was a wind-up. But given your form I am inclined to believe that you are serious.
Psych (pron. saik): A gross and deliberate misstatement of honour strength and/or suit length. Expressly permitted under Law 73E but forbidden contrary to that law by Acol club tourneys.

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Masterminding (pron. mPosted ImagesPosted ImagetPosted Imager-mPosted ImagendPosted Imageing) tr. v. - Any bid made by bridge player with which partner disagrees.

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#22 User is offline   ncohen 

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Posted 2017-February-13, 16:42

3S by N over 1N is enough at unfavorable. You have 2 tricks less than the bid. The vul 2S bid shows at least a 16-count. Raising to 3N compounds the error -- P isn't promising stops in 3 suits after your strong 2S bid. He can expect you to have some side strength.
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#23 User is offline   sfi 

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Posted 2017-February-13, 16:57

View Post1eyedjack, on 2017-February-13, 14:06, said:

Had it been someone else making your points I would have assumed it was a wind-up. But given your form I am inclined to believe that you are serious.


Not quite sure why you would make that assumption. There has been precious little evidence supporting it thus far.
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#24 User is offline   sdvdg 

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Posted 2017-February-13, 18:09

South made a slightly aggressive bid to try for game. IF North is just competing with a good weak two-bid type hand, bidding may get the partnership too high.

Had West led a diamond, South would run ten tricks. If South held the king of clubs instead of the king of diamonds, game would be laydown on a minor suit lead. The only way to set the contract would be a heart to East's ace, followed by a club switch with West holding the ace. Very unlikely.
So North's bidding was fine. It's easier to take nine tricks with the lead coming up to the South hand than 10 from the North side.
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