[dburn]

It is possible that blackshoe might wish to edit his post so that, for the most part, "West" becomes "South" and "East" becomes "North". Once this is done, I will have to edit mine. That's the biz.

But West, as PhilKing correctly suggests, is indeed entitled to know that 3♦ was a heart raise if (and only if) 3♦ really was a heart raise by agreement. The OP suggests that there was no agreement; if there wasn't, then that is all the information to which West is entitled. In those circumstances he might or might not bid 3♠.

[lamford]

dburn, on 2014-December-06, 17:43, said:

Oh, first seat red is the ideal time to psyche. Indeed, for most people (including aguahombre's partners) it is quite possibly the only time to psyche.

I would say that, for aguahombre's opponents, first seat red is the only time to psyche. He will assume his partner is the joker, much to his detriment.

[aguahombre]

lamford, on 2014-December-06, 20:05, said:

I would say that, for aguahombre's opponents, first seat red is the only time to psyche. He will assume his partner is the joker, much to his detriment.

Guaranteed, I have only found partner to be the joker once on purpose in some 25 years. And it wasn't to our detriment. Furthermore, every failure to alert by her was because she was busy figuring out her continuation and just plain forgot to do so. If she passed 3D in the OP case, it would have been a brain-fart and I would have UI that she was not accepting game....thus would have to bid game.

[Trinidad]

aguahombre, on 2014-December-06, 20:57, said:

Guaranteed, I have only found partner to be the joker once on purpose in some 25 years. And it wasn't to our detriment. Furthermore, every failure to alert by her was because she was busy figuring out her continuation and just plain forgot to do so. If she passed 3D in the OP case, it would have been a brain-fart and I would have UI that she was not accepting game....thus would have to bid game.

Why would it be UI that she wasn't accepting game? It is just a (presumed) implicit partnership agreement. They are not forbidden, they merely need to be disclosed.

Rik

[blackshoe]

dburn, on 2014-December-06, 19:18, said:

It is possible that blackshoe might wish to edit his post so that, for the most part, "West" becomes "South" and "East" becomes "North". Once this is done, I will have to edit mine. That's the biz.

But West, as PhilKing correctly suggests, is indeed entitled to know that 3♦ was a heart raise if (and only if) 3♦ really was a heart raise by agreement. The OP suggests that there was no agreement; if there wasn't, then that is all the information to which West is entitled. In those circumstances he might or might not bid 3♠.

Thanks, David. I've fixed it, I think.

[aguahombre]

Trinidad, on 2014-December-06, 22:34, said:

Why would it be UI that she wasn't accepting game? It is just a (presumed) implicit partnership agreement. They are not forbidden, they merely need to be disclosed.

Rik

Hmm..guess you are right.

[ruleof15]

I can't see the problem here. E-W can make 4♠. Their stopping requires more ability to handle interference. If one side tries to bluff by bidding on is one thing. Failure to evaluate a hand is another. If the opponents either miss the bid or its intention is no fault of theirs. Had west doubled and made 800 there would be no difficulty with the board. Not bidding to ones full potential is not the fault of the opponents.These players thinking psyche bidding works will find out that is a way to go for phone numbers when playing top competition. Psyching has been removed from ACBL games because of the stratification. In top competition it is tolerated. One psyche per round is allowed. When you suspect a psyche, call the director to get it recorded.

[blackshoe]

ruleof15, on 2014-December-07, 11:29, said:

Psyching has been removed from ACBL games because of the stratification. In top competition it is tolerated. One psyche per round is allowed. When you suspect a psyche, call the director to get it recorded.

Huh? Since when? The only thing I can agree with here is the last sentence.

[lmilne]

Everyone is discussing what North is allowed to do after South passes, whether it is AI, etc. I know which side of that I stand on - partner has clearly forgotten our agreement, and we can do whatever we feel is best, which might include bidding 4♥ here. But I don't think that is the key point at all.

What was the NS agreement?

Assuming their agreement was Bergen:

If West had known that 3♦ was a Bergen raise, and South had passed, West might well have passed as well. As others have commented, there is no hand where South can logically pass 3♦, and therefore he has forgotten the agreement. West might well play for the opponents having had a screw-up and defend 3♦. He was never allowed that opportunity because of the mis-information.

This argument would be a lot easier to make if the West hand wasn't so strong. If West held something like ♠AJxxxx ♥x ♦Ax ♣ KQxx and was bidding over 3♦ on the expectation that 3♦ was natural and EW might have a good black-suit fit, I think the ruling would be clear: 3♦ some number off. On the hand, West may well bid even suspecting the NS have had a miscommunication, as 4♠ doesn't require much to make. I still think he should get the chance to defend 3♦, however.

If their agreement was NOT Bergen, but something else e.g. natural:

No adjustment - clear-cut, IMO.

[PhilKing]

lmilne, on 2014-December-30, 18:04, said:

Everyone is discussing what North is allowed to do after South passes, whether it is AI, etc.

This is an overbid.