[MickyB]

IMPs. 3S would show both minors. Edit: 3C is vanilla Stayman

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[Fluffy]

I fold, but puppet stayman looks like a reasonable alternative.

[MrAce]

MickyB, on 2013-October-15, 02:08, said:

IMPs. 3S would show both minors. Edit: 3C is vanilla Stayman

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Need more info about system.

If we have a way to be able to play 4m after 3♠, in the case of no 5-4 or better fit, then i would bid 3♠ if not i will pass 2 NT.
I am aware we can make 5m easily in some hands where we have 9+ card fit.

[paulg]

At the table I bid 3♠, planning to raise if partner showed a minor.

Interestingly I just used this hand for training for the Scottish Juniors. The problem changed as RHO found a 4♥ overcall, Then questions about methods ensued.

[MickyB]

MrAce, on 2013-October-15, 13:14, said:

Need more info about system.

If we have a way to be able to play 4m after 3♠, in the case of no 5-4 or better fit, then i would bid 3♠ if not i will pass 2 NT.
I am aware we can make 5m easily in some hands where we have 9+ card fit.

Not a bad idea, but no, if partner rebids 3NT then 4♣ would be a slam-try. BTW, 2N:3S, 3N doesn't deny a four-card minor for us - we play 3N = unsuitable; 4m = four cards, not unsuitable; 4H = 3-3 minors, suitable.

I chose to pass at the table. It felt like I would get 3NT from partner most of the time, and I didn't fancy my chances there. If partner had responded 4m to 3S, I'd have been tempted to pass; We may already have picked up a swing just by bidding, and partner may raise 5m to 6m. To be honest, I didn't get as far as constructing hands for a 4m bid to decide whether I preferred passing to raising.

Spoiler

On the actual deal, partner has a huge hand that has, IMO, forgotten to upgrade - AJT Axx AJxxx AK. 6D goes off on a 5-1 club break, even if they don't lead spades. 2N was one off on a heart lead.

[Fluffy]

did they lead a heart or a spade?

[MickyB]

Fluffy, on 2013-October-17, 03:16, said:

did they lead a heart or a spade?

Spoiler edited

[PhilKing]

Against me, they bid 2NT-3♠-4♦-5♦-Pass.

Opener had a clear raise to slam even on a non-invitational auction imo, but whatever.

[ArtK78]

I play 4 suit transfers over 2NT, so I would bid 3NT - a transfer to diamonds. If partner bids 4♣, saying that he does not have a great fit for diamonds, I would pass, as it is likely that we have a club fit. If partner bids 4♦, I would pass that as well. My goal is to improve the contract, not find some miracle game.

[MickyB]

PhilKing, on 2013-October-17, 04:40, said:

Against me, they bid 2NT-3♠-4♦-5♦-Pass.

Opener had a clear raise to slam even on a non-invitational auction imo, but whatever.

Ouch.

[paulg]

PhilKing, on 2013-October-17, 04:40, said:

Against me, they bid 2NT-3♠-4♦-5♦-Pass.

Opener had a clear raise to slam even on a non-invitational auction imo, but whatever.

We bid the same way but the auction did not guarantee both minors and the lack of a major suit cue bid was the main reason to pass. Not sure I'd have managed it.

[DJNeill]

3S (both minors). This hand is dynamic and unpredictable, but I'm not betting a random 2N is that much better than a random 3N, or most 5 of a minor if partner has a good fit.

[aguahombre]

ArtK78, on 2013-October-17, 05:34, said:

My goal is to improve the contract or maybe find a nice game, not find some miracle game slam.

SYP

Hands such as the responding OP hand are why we don't use much modern stuff over 2NT; the OP has a serious problem here due to the methods. They might be more effective over the long haul, but we seem to come out o.k. with 3♠ MSS; and would have in this case as well. (Would prefer that partner were in the Opening seat to make the last choice whether to push 6D )

The problem with 3♠ (minors) here would be (as mentioned by others) what to do if Partner doesn't have a minor and rebids 3NT. We do have 4♣ as a mere P/C, but should we shoot out 3NT instead? I think not.

[ArtK78]

aguahombre, on 2013-October-17, 09:24, said:

SYP

Hands such as the responding OP hand are why we don't use much modern stuff over 2NT; the OP has a serious problem here due to the methods. They might be more effective over the long haul, but we seem to come out o.k. with 3♠ MSS; and would have in this case as well. (Would prefer that partner were in the Opening seat to make the last choice whether to push 6D )

The problem with 3♠ (minors) here would be (as mentioned by others) what to do if Partner doesn't have a minor and rebids 3NT. We do have 4♣ as a mere P/C, but should we shoot out 3NT instead? I think not.

I don't know what "SYP" means, but I meant what I said. I intend to play in 4 of a minor. Opener has no option over my 3NT bid but to either complete the transfer to 4♦ or to bid 4♣ without a diamond fit. I am passing whatever he bids.

[aguahombre]

"Stole" your post to state my goal, which was different from yours.

[the hog]

Fluffy, on 2013-October-15, 03:04, said:

I fold, but puppet stayman looks like a reasonable alternative.

If partner bids 3H?
I pass.