[jules101]

Partner and I play that a 2♦ opener is weak with both majors - at least 5-4 shape (never 4-4).

Our convention card* says the point range is 5-9ish (with caveat that with extra shape we may have fewer values).

Fourth board of our evening....

---

I was expecting partner to have a tad more for his bid when I plonked 6♥ on the table (which made on a misdefense).


By the end of the evening (rather than the end of the hand) our oppo described my partner's opening bid as a psyche....


I'm not sure if it is or not (and it evidently wasn't fielded given oppo had chance to score a top on this board).

I welcome your views....... (and I think - even before reading comments - that I will tinker with HCP/wording on our convention card).



* PS Convention cards seldom used in local bridge club, but I always have available when playing with regular partners. Last night I think we were the only pair out of 13 to have convention cards available! Not that changes my question or our bidding here.

[1eyedjack]

No, of course it isn't a psych. Nor was it fielded had it been one. And if it was a psych, what then? Report it and move on. Still no adjustment.

[hrothgar]

Looks more like what the ACBL would deem a deviation than a psyche

[helene_t]

3 HCPs plus a bit of extra shape is not a gross deviation from 5-9.

So it's not psyche.

[Endymion77]

It's not a psych, you're allowed to have a K more or less than the stated strength, and in this case you have extra shape too. If you do it regularly, you might be forced to change your convention card to include the actual range though (e.g. 2-9 instead of 5-9).

[nige1]

Endymion77, on 2013-October-01, 07:34, said:

It's not a psych, you're allowed to have a K more or less than the stated strength, and in this case you have extra shape too. If you do it regularly, you might be forced to change your convention card to include the actual range though (e.g. 2-9 instead of 5-9).

As far as I know, in Scotland, it's a deviation not a psych if your hand differs by a point or a card from your declared requirements: but a king would make it a psych. Watching international competitions on BBO, I've noticed that players are more and more likely to "deviate" (especially when opening a weak two or 1N). Also, directors have become increasingly tolerant. To me, this seems against the letter and spirit of the law but again I'm the only man in step

[RMB1]

helene_t, on 2013-October-01, 07:27, said:

3 HCPs plus a bit of extra shape is not a gross deviation from 5-9.

... and even less of deviation from "5-9ish (with caveat that with extra shape we may have fewer values)"

[paulg]

nige1, on 2013-October-01, 08:02, said:

As far as I know, in Scotland, it's a deviation not a psych if your hand differs by a point or a card from your declared requirements: but a king would make it a psych.

I hope that they are not so dogmatic and I haven't seen anything written down about this in Scotland. I doubt that they get many accusations of psyching and it would be reasonable to make a judgement on each occurrence.

nige1, on 2013-October-01, 08:02, said:

Watching international competitions on BBO, I've noticed that players are more and more likely to "deviate" (especially when opening a weak two or 1N). Also, directors have become increasingly tolerant. To me, this seems against the letter and spirit of the law but again I'm the only man in step

Given the general lack of system cards for BBO Vugraph I don't understand how you can tell when people are deviating? Although I really dislike people saying 'just bridge' to prevent disclosure, at the highest levels of the game there is a lot of experience and general bridge knowledge that experts are not going to follow their system cards to the exact point count, they are going to upgrade and downgrade hands, open light in third seat and not guarantee two of the top three honours when they pre-empt - this is 'just world-class bridge'.

And, to me, this is completely in line with the letter and spirit of the law.

[mycroft]

One card can be a psych (Flannery with 5-5, anyone?); one point can be a psych-or-illegal-deviation ("Precision" 1♣ with a flat boring 15? How about 10-15 Flannery with a 4522 9-count?), never mind 3 (so a 15-17 NT with a flat 12 isn't a psych? Really?) Sometimes, however, you have more latitude - it depends on what the agreement is.

I would wonder about not a psych, but "careless" disclosure - 5-9 with 5-4 would lead me to believe that you'd at least be KT-fifth T8-fifth or with a void to do 3-count 5-5 (but as you said, you were surprised, so it's a subminimum even by your agreement). If the defence could have been better if they were aware (not likely, as the subminimum is dummy) then there may be an issue.

I would be very careful about disclosure in these situations (you can't call it 2-9 when it's really "5-9, but with serious extra shape, could be fewer high (might even do it with a zero-count 7-6 or 6-6)" or whatever, or you're misdescribing just as badly) as "weak hand two-suit preempts" are the best time to "deviate" and win on the opponents playing you for the points you "have to" have (except of course for two-suiters where at least one suit is not known). As long as you explain your rules for opening correctly, and the agreement is legal where you play, then everything's fine. But I'd have more sympathy for "I played the heart guess through opener because she'd shown up with ♠QJ and no minor cards, and only 5=5, so I didn't think that one card was compensating enough for a no-control 3-count" than their problems when you're playing 6♥.

[nige1]

paulg, on 2013-October-01, 08:58, said:

Given the general lack of system cards for BBO Vugraph I don't understand how you can tell when people are deviating?

System cards are available. Helpful commentators read the meaning of each bid from the card.

paulg, on 2013-October-01, 08:58, said:

Although I really dislike people saying 'just bridge' to prevent disclosure, at the highest levels of the game there is a lot of experience and general bridge knowledge that experts are not going to follow their system cards to the exact point count, they are going to upgrade and downgrade hands, open light in third seat and not guarantee two of the top three honours when they pre-empt - this is 'just world-class bridge'.
And, to me, this is completely in line with the letter and spirit of the law.

If their system-card says pre-empts show 2 of the 3 top honours but they often deviate and field those deviations, then it may be just world-class bridge but it isn't completely in line with the letter and spirit of the law. Just my (minority) opinion