[the hog]

chasetb, on 2013-July-10, 20:48, said:

I'm surprised at this post. You REALLY can't see any advantage? Then let me teach you a thing or two.

First, you usually want the strong hand to describe and declare,

Snipped. Declare, "yes", describe "no".
Let me teach you a thing or two. Anyone who at any stage in their bridge playing life has ever played a relay system will be aware that the strong hand has MORE to show. Therefore the weaker hand should show and the strong hand ask. This is also common sense. Here you have a positive and a 6-4, a hand that is relatively easy to describe, so keep it at a lower level and bid 2S. IF you have the agreement that a positive shows 2/3 hons, then that is your problem. I don't like it.

Second, how about when opener has a balanced hand? You wrong-side the contract, and possibly get the partnership too high.

More stuff snipped. Yes and you might be hit by a truck when you walk into the street. You have a 2 suiter for heaven's sake. If opener has a bal hand, he bids 2NT and now you bid as per your system.


Third, even if opener has a minor hand (which seems likely), the auction isn't an issue if it goes 2♣-2♦, 3♦. When I bid 3♠, partner knows I have 5+ Spades,
More stuff snipped
Yes, except he has NO idea of your strength.

Next time before you attempt to teach someone something, perhaps you should think first.

[aguahombre]

the hog, on 2013-July-12, 18:52, said:

I cannot conceive of a 2D 'waiting" bid on this hand. This is a 2S response. If you are not going to bid 2S on this, what are you waiting for..13 spades?

Oh, you can conceive of a waiting bid on this hand because you can read the posts. You and your partner don't have to agree with those posts, and we don't have to agree that this "IS a 2S response". We accept that it IS a 2S response for you, however.

What are we waiting for? Again you can read; we are waiting for a suit which matches our agreements.

[Winstonm]

I doubt anyone can seriously doubt that in Standard methods the 2C opening and response structure is a glaring weakness. To think about hand types, there simply isn't enough room for a 2C opener to describe all hand types, so what makes the most sense is to cater to frequency. Basically, the most common types of big hands are NTs and 1-suiters. I would submit that a 2C system should be built around responding to those hand types.

[aguahombre]

Winstonm, on 2013-July-13, 10:05, said:

I doubt anyone can seriously doubt that in Standard methods the 2C opening and response structure is a glaring weakness. To think about hand types, there simply isn't enough room for a 2C opener to describe all hand types, so what makes the most sense is to cater to frequency. Basically, the most common types of big hands are NTs and 1-suiters. I would submit that a 2C system should be built around responding to those hand types.

And ...... For some of us those are pretty much the ONLY hand types. I conclude from your summary of what we know that you are in the "get out of opener's way" camp for first responses. Rigid top-honor requirements for a 2M response often assist opener in counting tricks and begin an accurate probe for specific controls.

A somewhat related observation: At the club level and on-line, I estimate there are 2-3 times as many opening 2C bids as there are in respectable competition. There, I doubt whether either the "get busy" or the "get out of the way" philosophy matters; the partnership will still be screwed a significant percent of the time.

[the hog]

aguahombre, on 2013-July-13, 08:30, said:

Oh, you can conceive of a waiting bid on this hand because you can read the posts. You and your partner don't have to agree with those posts, and we don't have to agree that this "IS a 2S response". We accept that it IS a 2S response for you, however.

What are we waiting for? Again you can read; we are waiting for a suit which matches our agreements.

You are going to be waiting a looooong time agh. Tell me, how many positives do you get in a year?

[aguahombre]

the hog, on 2013-July-13, 22:33, said:

You are going to be waiting a looooong time agh. Tell me, how many positives do you get in a year?

Not relevant. What is relevant is whether we need to show those positives immediately, whether our agreements about suit quality are random, and whether we can resolve strain later if partner is the slightest bit interested in the lengths of our suits. The answers depend on the discipline of the 2C bid itself and our agreed methods ---not on someone else's opinion based on their own methods.

[the hog]

Actually I think it is relevant as otherwise you have sequences that you use too infrequently to make them worthwhile.