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Best club-legal(ish) system

#21 User is offline   Jinksy 

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Posted 2011-August-28, 04:58

View PostFree, on 2011-August-27, 14:15, said:

It depends a bit on vulnerability. The 1-level is extremely safe (only V vs NV is dangerous). The 2-level is as safe as opening a weak two, but since opps have given up on game, they don't need the hands required for a weak two. When NV vs V, even the 3-level is relatively safe.


So what kind of a holding at the various vuls would you advocate overcalling/jumping on?
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#22 User is offline   Vampyr 

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Posted 2011-August-28, 05:15

View PostJinksy, on 2011-August-26, 10:54, said:

Also, anyone have views on weak-and-5? I persuaded myself recently, with reasoning almost immediately forgotten, that this is a good combination...


It is my favourite combination. One reason is that you open 1NT pretty frequently, which is a good thing. Also opener will not open 1m with a weak NT and a non-suit, so partner can compete more aggressively. And it is nice for major openings to be 5 cards.

Weak and 4 and strong and 5 are not really very good combinations, but for some reason they are much more popular than the others. Probably tradition/fashion.
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#23 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2011-August-29, 05:51

My point of view is that it is more important to increase your judgement playing Bacon Torpedo before you switch to something more esotheric.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#24 User is offline   Jinksy 

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Posted 2011-August-30, 06:01

View PostFree, on 2011-August-28, 02:00, said:

I don't think Fantunes is a good suggestion, it's randomizing results too much. The system looks natural, but continuations can get very complicated, it requires very good hand evaluation and you need some luck after 2-level openings. I've played a version based on the original Italian notes, but we modified some stuff because we thought our modifications made the system much more performant and efficient (for example the jumps to 2-level being only a 5 card suit are hard to handle if opener doesn't have fit). The 2-level openings can also be complicated to find fits in side suits and have a decent auction to slam.


I was thinking about this. Seems like it shouldn't be too hard to develop a more intricate feature ask system featuring a couple of multi-way bids, that allow you to ask partner things like 'are you 5-4 or single-suited?' (agreeing to define 6-4 etc as one or the other) at the same time as finding out if he's max/min. If you have a lot of points but no definite fit for p, you don't expect the opps to get involved in the auction. I guess you don't want to have takeout Xes though...
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#25 User is offline   phil_20686 

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Posted 2011-August-30, 09:51

Just play transfer methods in a strong and five. They are pretty easy and pretty good.
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#26 User is offline   Jinksy 

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Posted 2011-August-30, 10:12

View Postphil_20686, on 2011-August-30, 09:51, said:

Just play transfer methods in a strong and five. They are pretty easy and pretty good.


What are they?
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#27 User is offline   dake50 

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Posted 2011-September-02, 15:16

So many are claiming disrupt 1C (Polish) is effective,
but try the same disrupt of StdAm or natural prepared 1C.
Doesn't that same disrupt bid cause way more problems
because there is wa-a-y more strength categories AND wa-a-y
more shape categories to untangle?
I suggest looking at eg. Overcall Structure, Canape Overcalls,
Amsbury Jump Overcalls especially against 1C,1D prepared opening.
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#28 User is offline   hrothgar 

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Posted 2011-September-02, 16:10

View Postdake50, on 2011-September-02, 15:16, said:

So many are claiming disrupt 1C (Polish) is effective,
but try the same disrupt of StdAm or natural prepared 1C.
Doesn't that same disrupt bid cause way more problems
because there is wa-a-y more strength categories AND wa-a-y
more shape categories to untangle?
I suggest looking at eg. Overcall Structure, Canape Overcalls,
Amsbury Jump Overcalls especially against 1C,1D prepared opening.


Players aren't allowed to use the same set of defensive methods against "Standard" 1 openings...
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#29 User is offline   dake50 

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Posted 2011-September-02, 20:47

"Players aren't allowed to use the same set of
defensive methods against "Standard" 1C openings." --hrothgar

Surely you realize 1C that "could be short" qualifies to allow
ALL these conventional counters. As is precision 1D.
AND only a few are not allowed in general.
My point being that if you are investing in competing against
1C force, WHY are you not investing in competing against 1C prepared? !?
1C force has 16+
1C prepared has 12-22.
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#30 User is offline   hrothgar 

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Posted 2011-September-03, 05:04

View Postdake50, on 2011-September-02, 20:47, said:

"Players aren't allowed to use the same set of
defensive methods against "Standard" 1C openings." --hrothgar

Surely you realize 1C that "could be short" qualifies to allow
ALL these conventional counters. As is precision 1D.
AND only a few are not allowed in general.
My point being that if you are investing in competing against
1C force, WHY are you not investing in competing against 1C prepared? !?
1C force has 16+
1C prepared has 12-22.


Even if folks are playing a prepared club, there is no guarantee that the directors agree with your interpretation of the rules.

I've seen Bermuda Bowl rulings that bared the use of conventional defenses to prepared club openings.
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#31 User is offline   Vampyr 

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Posted 2011-September-03, 10:39

Over 1 that could be 2 cards and 1 precision-style, my regular partner and I play that 2 is a weak jump overcall with hearts or spades. I don't know if this is very effective, but it's fun (at least I'm sure it will be when it comes up...)
I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones -- Albert Einstein
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