[han]

Hand 1: All red, imps.

x AKxxxx xxx Axx.

1C - 1H
1S - 2D
3C - ??

Partner bids 4D if possible, what's your third and fourth call?

This is open for discussion now. I will post the comments from the panelists in a few days. Panelists, give the non-panelists a chance to discuss the hands first please.

[hrothgar]

Mark me down for

4♣ over 3♣ and
4♥ over 4♦

We're playing IMPS, so I'm not all that concerned about 3N versus 4M versus 5m.

I'm used to a 1♠ rebid by partner showing an unbalanced hand.
The 3♣ rebid should show 5+ clubs

Axx with a ruffing values looks pretty nice to me...
I'm going to raise clubs and focus attention on the Diamond suit

[Phil]

I'm already on record for my answers, so I will post what I sent to Han.

4♣ / 4♥.

I’m going to make my first complaint about the conditions that specify, whatever you bid, partner will next bid 4♦. The obvious choices now seem to be 3♥ and 4♣. Even though I prefer 4♣, 4♦ has a different meaning over 3♥ as 4♣, so I don’t see how I can be furnished with this knowledge without it affecting my decision. I’ll do my best to ignore this.

I would have bid 3♥ over 1♠ with this. A spade rebid isn’t good news for me and I don’t know that I like the idea of forcing to game opposite what may be a 4=1=3=5 or even 4=2=3=4 minimum that would pass 3♥. However the auction has worked out nicely with the knowledge of a nice club fit.

3♣ really shows 6 the way I play. With a 4=1=3=5 without a diamond stopper, partner has the option of rebidding 2♠, which does not show a 5-6 (these hands rebid 3♠). I’m starting to like my hand on many fronts.

4♦ confirms a control, and I will continue to cooperate with 4♥ now. I would like to RKC at this point, but I cannot be sure of 7 even if partner turns up with A + A + KQ, so I will volley the ball back to partner. Hopefully he can guess better than I can.

[mike777]

3h easy
5c now over 4d

[Echognome]

My reply to Han was as follows:

4♣ - Although I have only shown 4 hearts thus far, Partner has shown a likely 4-6 in the blacks. My values are sharp and our hand is very suitable for a club slam. After partner bids 4♦, I will bid 4♥ as a cue-bid for clubs.

[whereagles]

3♥ first, not caring much whether this is game forcing or not. The hand is good enough for game anyway.

Over 4♦, which I'd take as a heart cue, I'll settle for a quiet 4♥ because that could be just a courtesy cue.

Ok next problem... hope I give now the same answers I sent to han!!!

[Fluffy]

As Phil I will try and find my answers to Han:

3♥ then 6♣

At first I though my hand was too weak to try for a club slam, I think I would had just rebid 3♥ instead of 2♦!. Over 3♥ 4♦ looks to me like a 4216 with extras. Now I am thinking about grand, it is true that the grand slam can be very good, but the time to bid the right strain is now or never.

----

Mmm so I switched my mind from partscore to game, then to possibly grand slam lol.

[Free]

I think 3♥ is pretty obvious because we're looking for a ♥ game. If partner now bids 4♦ it looks to me like a cue with ♥ fit. Apparently I voted for 4♥ after that, but I'm not sure why I didn't make another move.

[P_Marlowe]

3H followed by 4H.

#1 3H - in the auction before, the 6th heart was not yet shown.

#2 4H - 2D was FSF, and I assume game forcing, we have a nice,
but we also promised a nice hand, and we are min, we will have at
best a 6-2 fit in hearts, and a 5-3 fit in clubs, the latter is not
certain, we may have a 6-3 fit in clubs, we just dont know.

At one point in time, we have to start with limiting our hand, and the
time is now.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[han]

Hand 1: All red, imps.

x AKxxxx xxx Axx.

1C - 1H
1S - 2D
3C - ??

Partner bids 4D if possible, what's your third and fourth call?

Paul: 3H, 4H.
Michael: 4C, 4H
Ben: 3H, 6C
Adam: 4C, 4H
Josh: 4C, 4H
Fred: 4C, 4H
Nigel: 4C, 4H
Andy: 3H, 5C
Vincent: 3H, 4H
Gonzalo: 3H, 6C
Frances: 3H, 4H (2/3) and 4C, 4H (1/3)
Roger: 4C, 4H
Justin: 4C, 4H
Hanoi: 4C, 4H

The two part nature of this problem makes it somewhat unusual. After 4C, the 4D bid shows little more than a cuebid, but after 3H, the 4D bid shows slam interest in hearts.

Some panelists agreed that this was an easy problem.

Ben: This is a classic 3H rebid, and I think should be unanimous or nearly so.

Paul: 3H is an obvious first bid.

Josh: 4C then 4H, seems easy.

Before we look at the votes of the panel, let us first consider the 3C bid.

Fred: No doubt this is partly a matter of style/partnership, but for me partner's 3C strongly suggested a 6-card suit (since 1S promised 5+ clubs and since partner could have bid 2H over 2D with a doubleton or 2NT without a true stopper in diamonds).

Paul: An important agreement for any serious partnership is the rebid in a fourth-suit auction. Does 2S show 5-5 or 5-6, or can it be 4-2-2-5 or 4-1-3-5 with no diamond values? I happen to play that 3C promises 4-6.

Andy: 3H. I'd like opener to be promising six clubs, but in Bridgebase Advanced I assume he could be 4225. If he is that shape, he will lack a diamond control (no 2NT bid), and we'll probably belong in 4H.

Frances: 1a) If partner's 1S showed an unbalanced hand including 4-5 in the blacks and hence 3C showed a 6th club (because partner would have bid 2H with a 4225) and very likely a singleton heart. No I bid 4C, and 4H over 4D
1b) If partner's 1S could still be a weak NT I bid 3H over 3C. Now 4D shows a good 4H bid which by inference will be 4=2=1=6 but I've already shown a game force with 6 hearts and I am nervous about the 5-level. I think I just bid 4H, but I am aware I am being a bit of a wimp here, partner isn't going to move with Axxx Qx x KQJxxx, but in an unknown partnership I'm frightened he has something horrible like KQxx xx Ax KQJxx (I would bid 2H over 2D with that, but many people might not). 
1c) If i have no idea what the system is I go with 1b because at least I end up in a making game that way.

I also don't know what it means in BBA, but I think we should use BBA more as a rough guide than as a system. For this kind of (important!) subtlety, I find it more interesting to hear what you prefer, rather than what BBA might say. If there is a next time, I'll be sure to mention this with the problems.

Vincent mentions that partner can have 5 clubs for his 3C bid.

The 4C-bidders all bid 4H at their next turn, and several comment that this is a cuebid and does not suggest playing in hearts. Michael does mention that if partner bids 4H, then that would be a suggestion to play there.

Roger: 4C, we have a good hand for slam, and any other bid will muddle the later auction. Over 4D, we have an easy 4H cuebid, but after that it's up to partner.

Justin: I would bid 4C. I have a great hand for a slam in clubs. Over 4C, I would bid 4H. My hand is not strong enough to bid blackwood.

The five 3H bidders have a more difficult second bid. Several mention that if partner could be 4225, then 4D doesn't even promise a control as it is the only available slam try in hearts.

Paul (with Vincent similarly): 4D should be a cue bid for hearts, but my slam interest is not great opposite a hand that could not find a jump rebid.

Gonzalo: At first I though my hand was too weak to try for a club slam, I think I would just rebid 3H instead of 2D. But 4D looks to me like a 4216 with extras. It is true that the grand slam can be very good, but the time to bid the right strain is now or never.

Andy rebids 5C which he intends as a cuebid for hearts. This is still under the assumption that partner could be 4225 for his 3C bid, so perhaps he hopes that partner will suggest 6C with a good 6-card suit?

This hand comes from the BBO practice bidding room. Partner had AKQx xx x KQ109xx.

Scores:

4C, 4H = 100 (8 1/3)
3H, 6C = 80 (2)
3H, 4H = 70 (2 2/3)
3H, 5C = 60 (1)
3H, 4NT = 40 (0)
5C = 20 (0)

After 3H there is a choice between 4H and bidding on. As there are more panelists that bid past 4H and some of the 4C bidders comment on the slam potential in clubs (which should be greater after 3H - 4D), I've given the 6C rebid more points than the sign off.

[han]

Fluffy, on 2011-June-01, 07:38, said:

As Phil I will try and find my answers to Han:

3♥ then 6♣

At first I though my hand was too weak to try for a club slam, I think I would had just rebid 3♥ instead of 2♦!. Over 3♥ 4♦ looks to me like a 4216 with extras. Now I am thinking about grand, it is true that the grand slam can be very good, but the time to bid the right strain is now or never.

----

Mmm so I switched my mind from partscore to game, then to possibly grand slam lol.

I had in mind that the panelists would mind until I post the wrap-up. It's fine though.

[Phil]

If I were conducting a poll for BBA (a la BWS) I would ask if 1m - 1♥ - 1♠ shows an unbalanced hand. I would also ask if a 2♠ rebid by opener after 4SF is a 'punt' or shows something else.

The 3♥ / 4♥ answers and scoring award seem really odd to me. We choose to GF this, and partner makes the strongest raise possible via 4♦. We are looking a stiff spade (great), AKxxxx (awesome, but not unexpected), no wastage in diamonds opposite partner's likely stiff, and a huge ♣Axx. Signing off is incomprehensible to me, and 4♥ gets only 10 points less then 3♥ / 6♣? And 3♥ / 4N only scores a 40?

Bizarre.

[han]

I don't like the sign-off either, but I've based the scoring on the votes and answers of the panel. For further complaints about the scoring, please contact cantstopcomplaining@bpo.nl.

[Mbodell]

Will the choices of the non-panelist respondents also be published?

I used the google doc to answer the poll, but didn't otherwise save my answers.

[benlessard]

4C/4H WTP was my responses.

If partner got 4216 we are going to slam anyway.