[jcerni]

Do you want to arrange cards according to requirements, for example, if you wish to sort cards for a reverse? Then, you can bid and play bridge on BBO. Here's an Excel application that does just that. If you have students, you can create exercises for them to learn Contract Bridge, etc. You can get the Excel application at the following link: https://sesgs.si/dok...t-6-8-2023.xlsm

Youtube link on Video-guide: https://youtu.be/7AaGZunaFkk

[mycroft]

Does this do anything that the hand generator linked here, or in BBO doesn't do?

Or any of the lin converters that exist?

Or Dealer/redeal with output style:PBN and any random accept script? (okay, and pbn-to-lin if we're going to import them into BBO). Sure, that requires knowledge of Tk/python, but not much...

Being serious here - I can't work out from the screenshot what it actually does - it looks like it's a graphic "press this button to add this card to the relevant hand".

Another issue. Now this criticism is very personal - I do realize that I'm in the minority (or at least business thinks I am in the minority) - but still. Video tutorials are ways to explain/give a specific example of the confusing bits of the manual that may not make sense just reading. If the video tutorial *is* the manual, well, everything's confusing, and there's a less confusing program over there I can use instead.

[jcerni]

The Excel application "Prepare cards for playing" performs the following operations for contract bridge:

Example:

1♣—1♥ (F)—2♦ (This is a two-suited hand 5♣/4♦ with 17-20 HCP and is a reverse)

With the Excel application, you can specify the cards for this scenario (N, E, S, W). For example, South (the opener) must have the following suits: 5♣/4♦ and 17-20 HCP, etc. Once you have specified the cards, you can play the game on BBO using manual dealing.

There are probably professional programs available to do this, as you mentioned earlier. I would appreciate it if you could indicate if any are accessible. It's likely not possible to do this directly on BBO.

You can also provide this application to students, and they can learn, for example, possible openings. For instance, they have information like NS holding 5♥ (South), 12 HCP (South); North: 3♥, 8 HCP. Now, in the application, they can specify the cards for this scenario. In BBO's manual mode, they can bid and play the game. This way, students experience the game, making it less abstract than bridge can be from books. You can even simulate all the complicated bridge scenarios from books with these tools to make them more comprehensible and logical.

[smerriman]

jcerni, on 2023-August-07, 00:15, said:

It's likely not possible to do this directly on BBO.

It's exactly what you can do on BBO in a bidding/teaching table via the menu - 'Deal Source' - Advanced tab. Excel isn't the right tool for this.

[sfi]

It's more than possible, the syntax to set it up is very easy. Once you get to the place smerriman pointed you to, you can put in the code to meet your specifications.

For example, your basic example can be written as:

condition shape(south, xx45) and hcp(south)>=17 and hcp(south)<=20

You would need a few changes to really get the hands you want, but that's much of the way there.

You can find a link to the syntax and play around with it at https://www.bridgeba...aler/dealer.php.

[jcerni]

smerriman, on 2023-August-07, 01:00, said:

It's exactly what you can do on BBO in a bidding/teaching table via the menu - 'Deal Source' - Advanced tab. Excel isn't the right tool for this.

I assume that to play at the bidding/teaching table, you need to have BB$.I don't know nothing about BB$. Can you explain to me more about BB$. I guess that is only Hand Editor for free.

[sfi]

jcerni, on 2023-August-07, 02:10, said:

I assume that to play at the bidding/teaching table, you need to have BB$.I don't know nothing about BB$. Can you explain to me more about BB$. I guess that is only Hand Editor for free.

The bidding table is totally free, including robots as opponents.

You need BB$ to use robots at play tables (except on the first of each month), but I don't know about teaching tables.

There is a link to BB$ from the login page of the BBO website (top right of the page). As I understand it $1 is effectively the same as $1 USD, but you can't redeem BB$ for cash. Information explaining them is at https://doc.bridgeba...utbbdollars.php.

One thing I have read is that you should purchase them from the website rather than from the BBO app. Otherwise the App store takes a large cut of your payment (30% from memory, but that could easily be wrong or have changed) and you wind up with less BB$ than expected.

[mycroft]

Bidding table is just that - a place where you set your constraints and bid hands. There is no play, just look at the hands after the auction to see if you were on the same page, or if your judgement (or your system) can be improved. You can ask for no competition or robot competition in the auction. Great way to, say, run 40 hands in an hour where the auction starts 1NT-2♥!; 2♠!-2NT so you can hit all of the obscure later sequences.

Teaching table might have robots to play against, but again isn't intended for that. The teacher can/should play (and bid) the defenders' hands (yes, both of them, it's not a competition, it's a teaching tool). You have the advantage that one of your pupil pairs doesn't have to just pass and play defence against fixed hands all day, or swapping them (or the boards) out.

If you want to play with constrained hands, you can use the dealer (sfi's example) or Thomas Andrews'/anntzer's dealer to create lin/pbn-converted-to-lin files and load them into a table. But ensure everybody knows this - and if the hands are constrained to give you (say) minor reverse hands, is comfortable with it.

[jcerni]

Is it possible to play with your partner and with 3 robots for free? I have found Casual -> I have a partner. Take us to table -> There are not robots but real people.

[smerriman]

That was already answered above:

sfi, on 2023-August-07, 03:47, said:

You need BB$ to use robots at play tables (except on the first of each month)

[antepa]

jcerni, on 2023-August-08, 23:44, said:

Is it possible to play with your partner and with 3 robots for free? I have found Casual -> I have a partner. Take us to table -> There are not robots but real people.

If you have a human partner, it is impossible to use 3 more robots, only 2. There are 4 players in total at any given table.

You can play against another human, having as a partner a ROBOT for free, by joining a FREE ROBO tournament, provided that you qualify for this sort of tournaments (TCR etc.) that are sometimes available on BBO.

[mycroft]

Having said that (serious question), why would you want to?

I understand playing in the Permanent Pickup Pool and its problems (although it's less bad when it's the opponents maligning your skill and not partner); but bridge is best with human opponents. And there are thousands of tables in play at any time of the day or night here, and more on the other sites.

One issue with the robots that might not be obvious is the issue with any fixed group of opponents (usually a "weak" fixed group here): you don't learn how to play well, you learn how to beat the robots. Which will include some very dangerous and bad habits that, when you move on to people, it will be very hard to break when you find they don't work any more.

But again (serious question): why do you want to play (as opposed to bid, or teach with constructed hands) against robots? I think the answer to that question is your actual problem, and the solution to it could very well be something other than "play with robots". See "XY problem". Again, note that this is incredibly common, and in no way a criticism if, indeed, that's what it is (or if it's not! Maybe there's an obvious reason I don't see! Won't be the first time I've missed a Logical Alternative that was obvious to everyone else!)

[pescetom]

mycroft, on 2023-August-09, 10:23, said:

Having said that (serious question), why would you want to?

I understand playing in the Permanent Pickup Pool and its problems (although it's less bad when it's the opponents maligning your skill and not partner); but bridge is best with human opponents. And there are thousands of tables in play at any time of the day or night here, and more on the other sites.

One issue with the robots that might not be obvious is the issue with any fixed group of opponents (usually a "weak" fixed group here): you don't learn how to play well, you learn how to beat the robots. Which will include some very dangerous and bad habits that, when you move on to people, it will be very hard to break when you find they don't work any more.

But again (serious question): why do you want to play (as opposed to bid, or teach with constructed hands) against robots? I think the answer to that question is your actual problem, and the solution to it could very well be something other than "play with robots". See "XY problem". Again, note that this is incredibly common, and in no way a criticism if, indeed, that's what it is (or if it's not! Maybe there's an obvious reason I don't see! Won't be the first time I've missed a Logical Alternative that was obvious to everyone else!)

Maybe there's a Logical Alternative that you both miss, namely playing with a robot against (mainly) human opponents. You can do this by signing up for pairs tournaments (free or not) with a robot as partner (not free). I do this when I'm not in a fit state to satisfy a regular partner or simply don't want the stress. It's less satisfying than playing well with a regular human partner but better than doing so badly and much better than playing with a random pickup.

[mycroft]

heh, yes. having said that, this Social Introvert, if not in a state to be trusted with a partner, definitely has no time for opponents...and is probably best suited to some other game (I'm partial to Diablo) where I can be safed for future human interaction.

[pescetom]

mycroft, on 2023-August-09, 14:06, said:

heh, yes. having said that, this Social Introvert, if not in a state to be trusted with a partner, definitely has no time for opponents...and is probably best suited to some other game (I'm partial to Diablo) where I can be safed for future human interaction.

To each his own. Bridge for me is all about confronting human opponents, but an occasional session with a robot partner is useful in many ways.
Including being forced to think about a different system and scoring better to reassure myself that the human partnership is not all my fault